Pots Caused By Substance Abuse?

[ramakentesh]

I spoke to a General Practioner the other day to get a med cert from work for my back and I got chatting to him about POTS and how researchers in Australia think they have found a major cause of POTS, etc.

And he just randomly said that he heard it was caused by substance abuse or drug abuse and that only 'druggies' get it!

I couldnt believe it - he was bsaically insinuating that i caused my own pots from some drug usage!

I quickly talked him out of this hypothesis, but where the bloody **** would someone get that information from? He said he read it in a journal somewhere. i asked my POTS doctor and he laughed.

[lthomas521]

Sounds like that GP is dropping acid, to me.

Blame the victim. First we were neurotics just looking for attention, then we were lazy people who just don't have the moral fiber to tolerate the normal sensations associated with exercise. Now we are druggies?

This is weird. A few months ago I had a very vivid dream. I dreamed that I was at a doctor's appointment, and the doctor triumphantly told me that they had figured out the cause of POTS. Finally! I thought. Then he said, "It's a result of alcoholism. All you have to do is give up drinking." In my dream, I tried to reason with the doctor. "But I don't drink. I mean, I had one glass of wine at Easter at my parent's house, and that's all I've had all year." "Oh, so you do drink..." It went downhill from there, until the alarm clock mercifully went off. The doctor in the dream was so ill-informed about POTS, and so unreasonable, and so condescending. In other words, the dream was very lifelike!

[MightyMouse]

oy vey!

[Guest sonotech]

Well, I can say that I started having symptoms in my EARLY TEENS, and NEVER did ANY KIND of drugs. I never even took constant RX meds until I was in my 20's.

I have never heard of "substance abuse" causing POTS!!!

How strange!

[MomtoGiuliana]

Bizarre!

The funny thing is that so many of us are so sensitive to drugs and alcohol that we are probably less likely than the average person to abuse these substances!

Katherine

[futurehope]

Ramakentesh,

Do you realize that he was insinuating that YOU had been a drug user? Yikes!!!

The only thing I could come up with is that I wouldn't be surprised if for some of us POTS has been brought on by prescription drug use.

[sally]

What a nut!

This guy is probably talking about drug induced hypotension. He really should pull his Merck manual out of the closet and begin reading it again. I would be very interested in hearing what his genius ideas on the genetics side of this problem is and what the cause is.

I got one for ya....a new family doctor that is in our old family docs practice told me that the blood pressure issues are caused by the flight or fight response. I just looked at her dumbfounded and said really. Where do they get these ideas from? amazing.

[maggee]

that's my sentiments, exactly, Futurehope.......!!!!!!!!

had so many bad medication reactions...am lucky i survived some of them---truely!!!!!!!

grrrrrrrffffffffffffffffffffffffff!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Maggee

[MightyMouse]

Sally, actually, the doc who said it's "fight or flight" isn't that far off the mark...

fight or flight involves the body pumping out epinephrine in response to an emergency... sending blood flow to the major organs and brain quickly and speeding up your heart rate.

For some of us with POTS, this is what happens when we're upright and the blood pressure drops: the body gets the neural signal that there's an emergency because the brain's blood flow is dropping as the bp is dropping, and speeds up the heart rate by sending huge amounts of catecholes (including epi) into the blood stream in order to get more blood up to the brain, heart and lungs.

and, those with panic attacks have the fight or flight response for things that most of us don't respond to; some here have both panic attacks & POTS.

Nina

[LindaJoy]

Hi. I just got back from my new gp (who I'm liking very much), who said that she learned about POTS in medical school and that they're teaching these students that POTS patients are just experiencing anxiety / depression (in other words, that it's psychiatric), only a bit more over the top with sensitivities. She said she's since learned differeently since dealing with real POTS patients. Thank goodness for that.

Oh, and I've never even smelled marijuana in my life, let alone done any other drugs to have caused my POTS. Oh, my. What will they come up with next??????

Linda

[AJVDK]

WOW! I can't beleive that he really thought that pots was casued by Substance abuse.

[sally]

Nina,

thanks, I'm aware of those points. Maybe I just didn't make myself clear enough. She was making a off the cuff remark that seemed to lump ALL orthostatic patients into one statement, like it was something we had control of. Fight or flight response is just that, a response from stress whether physical or mental causes what I'm aware of anyway and as you have stated in your response. But, I thought was not the primary cause in all cases. guess you just had to be there. But I'll do some more reading.

[worththewords]

I'm only months away from being a certified addiction counselor. I feel like I have a vast amount of knowledge of substance abuse and the physiological role that it plays on our bodies. It's ridiculous to hear a doctor come up with that idea without any substantial backing. As others have mentioned, in an indirect way, he was suggesting you were a substance user/abuser. I would have taken great offense to that assumption.

Personally, I've never tried drugs and I only drank very little in high school. For the life of me I couldn't figure out why drinking made me feel so horrible at the time...now I know what it was doing to my body! I only got into this field because I saw what a mess addiction was making in the lives of people I cared about.

It's sad to hear what Linda shared about medical schools teaching that POTS patients just have anxiety/depression. I have a friend in medical school who has yet to hear the term dysautonomia or POTS despite intense studying of the nervous and cardiovascular system. I'm not sure what is worse, an uneducated doctor or a misinformed doctor.

[dizzygirl]

WOW!!!!!!!! now i cant say as i have heardthat one before!

Now a thought if substance abuse and alcoholism is causing us potsy to be potsy.. wouldnt the majority of american's have our symptoms too!!!!!

I mean come on! That is just ludicirise!! absurd and barbaric thinking.. my goodness!

When is the medical profession's people going to wake up?? dysautonomia and all that can and does go with it is VERY REAL!!!

geesh

[nadine]

This makes me sooooooooo angry. I really would like to see this article that GP was commenting about.

For years I have heard the same old comments regarding CFIDS from many physicians, regarding anxiety and depression. I really believe that most of these physicians won't get it until it hits close to home, one of their family members!!!!!!!!!!

I once sat in a meeting for work with several physicians that I worked with and a consultant, a pt. review was being done and one pt. has CFIDS and the consultant made a flip comment about how it didn't really exist and laughed. Six other physicians all looked at me thinking I was going to jump the table, as they knew my history. I simply said " I am sorry to hear that you feel that way, I can tell you personally that it is very real" looking her straight in the eyes. She moved on to the next pt. and that was it!!!! I was so angry to see the flip attitude of such a well respected proffesional.

I see the same responses with NCS and POTS.

I also don't drink, smoke or use any illegal drugs-- prescribed are my only problems, agree with comments regarding sensitivities. I don't like to take anything and try to avoid it as much as possible. I hate starting new meds for fear of reaction.

[Clairefmartin]

I have done lots of drugs in my short life (unfortunately I was a BAD teenager) and told all my doctors about it. They all said it had no cause or effect of any kind on my POTS or any of my current health issues.

I think my memory has suffered a bit from my past activities, but thats it.

That doctor was being silly

[Guest Julia59]

EDIT

[Guest dionna]

i always get asked if i am pregnant, on drugs, if i am drunk, or if i have an eating disorder. so i believe it! i just think that they have a problem with believing that a patient actually has a problem or they just don't want to actually work! just my opinion though.

dionna

[Sophia3]

Sadly, there was a person on another board and years, ago...whenever she would end up in the ER in a big City in the South, they thought she must be on Cocaine due to the severe Tachycardia. They implied this more than once.

I can believe ANYTHING anymore from doctors. The COMPASSIONATE ones are far and few between.

The NEW AGE BLAME THE VICTIM mentality has done NOTHING for invisible illnesses in the medical profession.

[Guest dionna]

What a nut!

This guy is probably talking about drug induced hypotension. He really should pull his Merck manual out of the closet and begin reading it again. I would be very interested in hearing what his genius ideas on the genetics side of this problem is and what the cause is.

I got one for ya....a new family doctor that is in our old family docs practice told me that the blood pressure issues are caused by the flight or fight response. I just looked at her dumbfounded and said really. Where do they get these ideas from? amazing.

i was told by a navy corpsman that i was passing out continuously because of impounded earwax! yeah right. i've heard a lot of them. oh and i forgot to mention before that i have never used drugs. so that doc is totally wrong. atleast i am sure in many cases.

[Poohbear]

I'm not sure what is worse, an uneducated doctor or a misinformed doctor.

I would say a misinformed Dr is worse. #1 Because it means at least the "teacher" was also stupid. #2 It's harder to get Dr's to "unlearn" their misconceptions than it is to teach them proplery up front.

"Uneducated" is an easier solution to solve than stupidity or blatant disrespect

[bttrflyamby1981]

i always get asked if i am pregnant, on drugs, if i am drunk, or if i have an eating disorder. so i believe it! i just think that they have a problem with believing that a patient actually has a problem or they just don't want to actually work! just my opinion though.

dionna

I'm all the time asked if I'm pregnant....if only it was that simple! Although I question it myself at times even with my tubes tied. It would be easier to explain that's for sure.

Amber

[sky]

Ramakentesh,

Do you realize that he was insinuating that YOU had been a drug user? Yikes!!!

The only thing I could come up with is that I wouldn't be surprised if for some of us POTS has been brought on by prescription drug use.

I do not have POTs but PAF No doctor ever implied that it was anything other than a serious physical problem but for over twenty years, I took a beta blocker, Inderal, for a genetic tremor. Because, it lowers the bp, I think that it might have caused the PAF Every doctor that I have suggested this says that could not be. The interesting thing is that I stopped taking the Inderal two years ago and the tremor has stopped The neuro at Vanderbilt said that was most unusual as that type of tremor gets worse with age and never goes away. Why do you think that prescri[tion drugs may have caused POTS or ANS?

[maggee]

Nina,

great reply/post!!!

....but as much as i've read,yada...i still can't easily explain what happs to us/why/how==POTS?????

WHAT ACTUALLY IS CAUSING THE bp to drop upon standing?

do we make too much of norepinephine and adrenaline?

read bout the 'spillover' of these 2 into the bloodstream....

if you kindly would, and have the time...

could you give us your best shot at the basic mechanics happening....in a POTS attack....and also a panic/anxiety attack...

.......would be so much appreciated!

[ i actually couldn't tell you the difference, as was dx'ed years ago with 'anxiety disorder' label.....and PROB HAVE HAD POTS ALL THESE 30 YEARS...(((( ]

[ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!]

you seem to have an awesome understanding of it all....which i am so eager to learn....especially in the nicely brain-friendly way you seem to have of explaining things

thanks in advance, Nina....

((((hugggs))) to you, and all today!!!!

Maggee

Sally, actually, the doc who said it's "fight or flight" isn't that far off the mark...

fight or flight involves the body pumping out epinephrine in response to an emergency... sending blood flow to the major organs and brain quickly and speeding up your heart rate.

For some of us with POTS, this is what happens when we're upright and the blood pressure drops: the body gets the neural signal that there's an emergency because the brain's blood flow is dropping as the bp is dropping, and speeds up the heart rate by sending huge amounts of catecholes (including epi) into the blood stream in order to get more blood up to the brain, heart and lungs.

and, those with panic attacks have the fight or flight response for things that most of us don't respond to; some here have both panic attacks & POTS.

Nina

[futurehope]

Sky,

The thought of prescription drug use allowing for the manifestation of POTS (in some people) was brought to my mind by another poster on this forum.

The poster, (Ramakentesh, I think), mentioned research going on in Australia that has to do with hypermethylation of a gene promoter causing a deficit in the transporting of norepinephrine.

Now, I don't know if I said all that correctly. But the point is, that in some cases, the "hypermethylation" could be caused by drugs (if I remember correctly). I remember an acne medication coming up in the discussion as one of them.

Hence, I've come up with the idea that in some cases, the POTS might have been brought on by a combo of the person's genetic make-up and the use of a certain drug.

Other than that, I know of no specifics to help you with.