Toxic Environment / Something In Air

[lieze]

Have any of you ever had an environment you simply cannot tolerate being in whether it is the source of your symptoms or somehow our condition makes us more sensitive?

I'm having it with our home right now.

This sounds crazy but when I breathe in whatever it is I can feel it in the air.

I do not get that feeling anywhere else just there.

I tried to spend the night Monday and Tuesday due to all the driving I was having to do.

I woke up Tuesday morning feeling like I was being suffocated.

I went outside and it took me a good 20-30 minutes to recover.

I had a period of confusion during this.

I had the feeling something was taking the place of the oxygen in my body-horrible feeling.

I had to open the doors wide open and it took about 2 hours to get enough fresh air in that I could stand being in there.

Then yesterday I needed to go in a back room to print something and it was bad.

The thing in the air was stronger there.

It does not have an odor that I sense it's a feel as I'm breathing it in.

I do not have asthma.

I just found out today when I spoke with my husband about it that several years ago when I thought we had mold and had it cleaned up that the tests were inconclusive-this is what he's telling me now??? That he just had it cleaned up anyway for the heck of it.

At the end of that clean up he ended up in the hospital with pancreatitis.

And since has had stomach tumors removed.

I don't know if whatever it is-environmental toxin? Is the source of my illness? I don't know.

A mouse died a cat died.

The cat we have now is only a year old and has a gait disturbance that just started. It's obese. When we would let it out in the summer it could not tolerate the heat and could not get back to the house on it's own. It's having recurrent bladder issues and urinates everywhere and seems confused.

I have stayed at my moms since June.

The kid's have slept there only on school nights but now that whatever it is is getting worse we're pulling them out of there.

They will be sleeping at my husbands parents and my husband will drive them to school until we get possession of our new house in about 2 weeks.

This is causing horrible stress for us.

I am scared to death somehow we will transfer this mystery toxin to the new house and contaminate it also.

I just don't know what to think or do.

I heard the agency we used before were con artists that tested and treated our house.

I wish there was a way to find out what it is-has anyone experienced anything like this-my husband just thinks I'm nuts.

My mom also experienced the respiratory issues and recognizes there is something unhealthy there. She thinks it is what has made me ill.

She could sense it helping us clean up prior to our appraisal when she was pulling things out from under the beds in the kid's room and also bringing sleeping bags here and washing them she said it was wafting up off of them and getting right in her face.

The next day she was experiencing weird symptoms-all she could see was a purple square and she had extreme nausea.

What in the world could it be?

[lieze]

Also I did not show a sensitivity on my allergy testing to dust, mold or things in the home so this is really curious but I feel there is a direct connection with my health-I just don't know how much.?

[Katybug]

Hi Lieze. It sounds like it could be mold. When you had the house cleaned did it include the furniture and carpets? Did you wash all the linens, clothes, curtains when they did it so everything would be decontaminated? Also, has the HVAC duct work been cleaned? That can hold all kinds of dust/mold spores/toxic stuff? I really hope things get better for you in the new house!!

[lieze]

I do not think anything was done with the duct work.

We lost tons that first round besides the 10 thousand it cost to do the chemical treatment.

We threw away our couches and matresses.

A lot of our stuff is still in storage.

Our carpets were professionally cleaned at that time and the carpet in the room that I was in that was so bad yesterday I had replaced when we moved back in. I had just asked my husband in August if we could clean our carpets. I was noticing it then and thought if we could pull out our carpet cleaner and use it-it might help clean up some of what was there. He basically threw a fit and didn't want to do it-thought I was asking for too much and went into a rant about not looking forward to me moving home-so I didn't.

The rant today I heard was even worse and I won't repeat it here. Needless to say I left and did not listen to any more.

I am all about trying to keep the peace but when it comes to something so potentially hazardous-it can't be overlooked.

It's very sad-I think it's making him sick too with the GI system rather than the nervous system but he seems to be in denial.

We need to get out stay out try to not transfer it over to the new place but then what do you do with the house?

Insurance does not cover the loss.

Here we have a home that at this time is not safe to sell or rent out to anyone.

[gertie]

When I first started getting sick I was so sensitive to my house I had to wear a mask inside. My DH also had allergies.

We started taking out carpet, scented products, shoe polish, dry cleaned clothing etc. It took a long time but I finally

got it clean enough I can live in it. I had to, I couldn't tolerate a new house. I am still very sensitive, if I don't dust regularly

I can smell the dust. It's a miserable life.

Have you checked your home for radon?

[lieze]

No I have not had it checked for radon it was suggested to me.

A person told me it's bad in our area.

In fact my sons kindergarten classroom had a radon leak that had to be repaired and his teacher quit shortly after that.

The school is within 5 miles from us.

I question if it is environmental.

Our neighbor at the same time developed a pain in her side. She had all types of testing and they could not find anything.

They moved and just resold their home.

It stood empty for a year.

I just don't know what we are to do and I am worried about whether I will have symptoms in the new place. I'm paranoid about that.

There isn't much carpet there-it's mostly tile and hardwood floors.

[Katybug]

I don't have any good suggestions but I'm just so sorry you are having to go through this. I can't imagine my home not being a place of comfort. I'm sure its hard.

[lieze]

Thank you Katybug.

I feel like at times I have so many things working against me and they are all somewhat intertwined my health, finances, 4 kids, a volatile relationship, only somewhat supportive parents.

I feel like my resources are limited and my problems are huge and then I think well how many other people are in the same situation or worse?

So somehow we have to prioritize health and safety first for everyone.

Then take it from there school and work obligations for husband and the kids.

It seems like we have just been in survival mode and not really living for many years.

I'm sure maybe others are dealing with just as difficult situations maybe different issues.

I'm trying to stay calm and see the hope in this.

What if it was the house?

What if my condition can improve in time being out of there?

Then comes the fear-what if we never escape it and take it with us and it continues to make us sick?

[MomtoGiuliana]

Google "sick building syndrome".

It could be mold, it could be other substances, if something is causing you to feel ill indoors.

This is from EPA website:

Introduction

The term "sick building syndrome" (SBS) is used to describe situations in which building occupants experience acute health and comfort effects that appear to be linked to time spent in a building, but no specific illness or cause can be identified. The complaints may be localized in a particular room or zone, or may be widespread throughout the building. In contrast, the term "building related illness" (BRI) is used when symptoms of diagnosable illness are identified and can be attributed directly to airborne building contaminants.

A 1984 World Health Organization Committee report suggested that up to 30 percent of new and remodeled buildings worldwide may be the subject of excessive complaints related to indoor air quality (IAQ). Often this condition is temporary, but some buildings have long-term problems. Frequently, problems result when a building is operated or maintained in a manner that is inconsistent with its original design or prescribed operating procedures. Sometimes indoor air problems are a result of poor building design or occupant activities.

Indicators of SBS include:

• Building occupants complain of symptoms associated with acute discomfort, e.g., headache; eye, nose, or throat irritation; dry cough; dry or itchy skin; dizziness and nausea; difficulty in concentrating; fatigue; and sensitivity to odors.
  
  
• The cause of the symptoms is not known.
  
  
• Most of the complainants report relief soon after leaving the building.
  
  

Indicators of BRI include:

• Building occupants complain of symptoms such as cough; chest tightness; fever, chills; and muscle aches
  
  
• The symptoms can be clinically defined and have clearly identifiable causes.
  
  
• Complainants may require prolonged recovery times after leaving the building.
  
  

It is important to note that complaints may result from other causes. These may include an illness contracted outside the building, acute sensitivity (e.g., allergies), job related stress or dissatisfaction, and other psychosocial factors. Nevertheless, studies show that symptoms may be caused or exacerbated by indoor air quality problems.

[bensman]

Lieze,

If you do happen to have toxic mold in the house, it would be advisable to get rid of anything porus before moving. That is how I initially crashed, living in a house with 3 strands of toxic mold. We sold EVERYTHING, including all clothes, furniture, anything electric or motorized, our vehicles, etc. It was very depressing but necessary. Mold spores get engrained and are almost impossible to remove. To this day if I enter a building that has one of those strands of mold, I immediately flush and become more symptomatic.

I would definitely get the house tested by a professional before making any huge decisions.

Good luck.

[lieze]

MomtoG - that sick building issue you posted about almost describes thus to a t.

The kids experience headaches and stomach aches, nightmares and disturbed sleep that staying with my mom didn't occur as much.

It was going on still when we first got here and then dwindled down over the summer.

Now that they are sleeping there it is all starting again.

Volley-do you think the mold triggered your POTS?

I am suspicious it is possible.

I don't know that I can know for sure our issue was mold but whatever it is in that house I

believe killed the mouse, killed the cat, made me sick and my husband. He still cannot eat normally is lucky to tolerate one meal a day is in a lot of stomach discomfort and has lethargy that

comes with it. INteresting!!!! Almost simultaneous he started in with high blood pressure that exacerbated with any stress but also came out of the blue. He had a couple

spikes that were scary before he got meds to control it where his bp was 200/100. He had to lay down and close his eyes. I was ready to take him to ER before he stroked out or had a heart

attack. His heart enzymes were also elevated.

I didn't really correlate his high bp's with the house issue but I think it could be related.

I wonder now if those high bp's could be an autonomic issue for him or neurological.

I'm worried he is not going to leave.

He is so emotional and when I told him it was at the bad stage again he flipped and I heard all kinds of non related garbage.

His final comment was he will stay in that house and me and the kids will move to the new place.

I think if he would just get out and go any where for about 2-3 months like I have he would start to notice the difference.

I can't make him believe me and I also can't know if the effects of that environment are affecting him cognitively too like putting him into a mental haze where he can't think straight.

[gertie]

Is your new home built with environmentally friendly materials such as formaldehyde free insulation & non toxic glues etc?

I bought radon testing kits & tested our home. I'm not sure they are as reliable as professionals but it's not expensive.

Ours tested under the danger level. If what I read is true it is a cause of lung problems.

I hope you do better in your new home.

[Dizzysillyak]

HI lieze

I had this problem when I first moved into my 1964 condo back in June. The first night was so bad I had to open all the windows to breath. My lungs and esophagis felt like I had fuzz in them ...

The landlord had the unit cleaned which helped quite a bit, but not to the extent I needed.

The problem is the a/c ducts since they are fiberglass and fiberglass is a breeding ground for molds, etc . Since I'm only renting I opted to open all the windows, remove all the vents, spray each duct with 1/2 bleach (IMHO, Clorox brand works the best) and 1/2 water, turn the a/c on full blast and leave for a couple of hours. Later, I came back and sprayed with Lysol and left again.

I'm still living here and notice that if I don't run the a/c constantly, I'll smell that odor again but my lungs and esophagis don't feel like they have fuzz in them. The plan is to do this again until the smell is completely gone. I'm just too tired to remember to do it ... lol ..

BUT ...

I've heard from several people who've said that their mold intolerance symptoms were reduced by eliminating food intolerances but ...

I have my food intolerances under control as far as getting any gluten, dairy, etc but I still reacted to this. Meaning, sometimes the mold is just too much for our bodies ...

Here's a thread started by slayadragon who has mold issues, and moved like you did ... She's the most mold toxin educated person I know ... hth ... dizzy

http://forums.phoenixrising.me/showthread.php?4627-Mold-Dr.-Cheney-and-ME-CFS&highlight=gluten

[lieze]

Thanks so much for that link Dizzy.

I think our area is a mold hotbed too.

Much of this area we live in used to be swampland. And lately it seems our water table is rising again.

We've had flooding here in the recent years and many people had their basements flood.

I'm suspect of this drainage system we have that opens up to the creek in the back that comes right up into our basement and there has been an odd smell down there.

We have seen salamanders well 1 or 2 that

have come up our drain. Anybody getting the quivers?

So anything in that creek with often wet moist soil could be contaminating our house.

It could be a weird off toxin.

So that was my number one goal to get back to civilization with city water, we have a well, and sewer, we have septic and away from that creek.

We also had to heat with fuel oil and propane for our hot water tank. I wanted to get back to natural gas and we ended up with geothermal instead.

We are surrounded by trees and our outside air did test positive for mold related to decaying rotting leaves and trees. It's a type of mold that affects respiratory system over time.

So we are back to city water sewer.

There is a creek in the far back of the new place to but it is not connected to the house in anyway.

This house does not have a basement-crawl space only.

It is a brick ranch that a builder purchased and lived in and he built up and out and the selling factor we were looking for is 5 bedrooms with the master on the main floor.

It has geothermal cooling and heating which is supposed to be both efficient and economical.

We'll just have to see about air quality.

It seemed okay while I was there.

I don't even know if the windows open they are huge in the addition part of the home.

They moved to Wyoming because he couldn't find steady work building houses around here in this depressed economy.

His family is heartbroken. In laws live right up the street and he did an addition onto their place also. It all looks super clean and fresh.

[lieze]

The addition in the new place is 5 years old so old enough that I didn't notice any glue smells from walls or flooring. I think most of that would have time to dissipate by now but I have my fingers crossed that it's a good environment for us.

[Dizzysillyak]

Hi again. I just realized that you have a peanut allergy. I have a good friend who has this is has to be constantly vigilant about not getting any cross contamination WHATSOEVER. If she does, her immune system freaks out and she gets infections, upper respiratory and urinary ... again ... she had infections regularly when she was a child because she didn't know about the peanut allergy.

She recently got sick because her roommate was using almond butter that was processed in a facility that processes peanuts in a shared blender ...

Having food and environmental allergies is a real pain ... I know ... tc ... d

[lieze]

I realize I'm a mess.

I don't know how we can pinpoint exactly the cause of my illness and I really don't know exactly how my body has been affected whether it is temporary or permanent.

I know I got hit with West Nile had a blood test that confirmed it-then chicken pox-went to ER with that then right after was fearful I got meningitis because I got a stiff neck and horrible headache. Received a diagnosis if viral syndrome after that. At the same time my bipolar husband was having a horrible episode so I had stress from that and thinking that the responsibility of the family financial and everything else was on my shoulders so incredible stress and pressure plus PTSD from listening to all the crazy stuff that flies out of his mouth. He will say anything absolutely anything he has no limits. Then whatever it is in that house. Well all that and I was just down for the count.

I tried to keep going and I kept collapsing with crazy scary symptoms.

Then the allergies started so it seems immune system related.

How to sort it all out then yes genetic tendency.

Other women in the family have similar physical problems.

It got me whatever it was or is.

[lieze]

In the beginning I had chest pain, racing heart, crazy heart pattern showed up on my holter with my heart actually stopping at several points. I threw that away because I couldn't stand to look at it.

With my head I saw halos around lights, felt as if I was going to fall when I walked, and had vertigo and migraines, pressure in the head snapping and oozing then all of that slowly went away over time and I just had a normal CT of the head thank you God.

It went all through my body with jolts of electricity going through my arms and legs.

Startling for no reason. Waking up screaming or with heart pounding or gasping for breath.

Then all my joints swelled up and got painful.

The collapsing episodes where my heart would race, I would feel as if I was going to pass out started from the beginning and lasted the longest I would say predominating symptom.

Then the horrible allergy reactions similar to a MCAD. I react to just odors and chemicals in the air.

That's what I've experienced in a nutshell.

Not sure if it's POTS or not.

Something rocked my nervous system.

Two CNS viruses back to back and a very stressful life + genetic tendency.

I really feel fortunate that I'm doing as well as I am all things considered.

[Katybug]

Hi Lieze. I just had two thoughts:

1) Maybe in the new house you could set up the electronic air filters/cleaners in each room to help keep the air cleaner for you. I know they are a financial investment but I definitely can feel the difference between the room I have one in and the other rooms in my house. I just use it in the bedroom when the spring allergy season hits so I can sleep better but it really does seem to help.

2) Based on what you describe in your last post, have you ever been tested for Lyme/tick-borne illness? Many of the symptoms you describe are what I experienced during the early onset of my tick-borne illness in 2007. Lyme can cause a lot of symptoms that people don't usually hear about like really bad nightmares, along with the things you do hear about like cardiac issues, neuro issues, joint pain/swelling. May be worth the blood test if you haven't been tested before.

[lieze]

Wow Katybug didn't know you were dealing with that. I've never been tested but we have ticks galore and pull them off of us all the time.

Bless your heart it sounds like you've been through a lot!

The air filters are a great idea.

I'll have to see what God provides for us.

If we have to start over again with all new furniture money is going to be very tight.

I'm also not sure if I will be doing it alone as hubby is saying right now he's not moving with us. So finances could be very compromised.

[sue1234]

Leize, have you ever had a doctor put you on any kind of cortisol to calm your "reactive" system down? A good holistic MD would handle that.

[Yolaclover]

wow Lieze, I read your post last night. I wonder how you will do in your new place. How is it going applying for disability? I did it yesterday.

[lieze]

Oh I've worried my cortisol might be too high.

I've always been high strung.

As I get a little stronger though I'm interested to investigate what's going on with my body more.

I'm going to have the bloodwork for my anemia panel today.

718 mom-I got a call back from the lawyer just yesterday checking in. I should hear by mid November whether I'm accepted or denied if I'm denied I'll contact the lawyer right away and they will represent me.

I might feel a relief then knowing that someone that understands the process is in control.

They will just charge 25% of my back pay if they win my case is what I understand.

[Yolaclover]

That's great Lieze, it's nice to know there are people out there to help! You are moving soon right? How are you handling that?

[lieze]

We should be in by end of this month or sooner.

Just waiting to get the email that the realtor has keys for us.

Not sure how hubby will be at that time.

I just went and transferred a CD that had matured into savings with the plan to buy four single matresses first. Hoping for a deal somewhere and I'll just have new furniture delivered directly to the home.

I really want to take as less as possible from the contaminated environment into the new home.

One day at a time. Not sure what help I'll have-talk about an adventure.

That back pay from disability would really come in handy right now but I guess none of us would refuse money at any point in our lives-it's something we always need.

I already have quite a bit charged on my credit card so I'd really like to use cash I have now to buy what I can.

I'm not sure about picking up used things at this time of year-and then I worry about whether they've been in mold also since we seem to have an issue in the area.

Can you believe the first house I went and looked at was built in 2000-just had flooding in March and there were black spots growing a good 2 feet up the basement walls.

Right then I was just asking the realtor-how in the world am I going to get away from it???

So I'd rather purchase new furniture and go light and add to as we can afford it and keep our environment decontaminated. I sound neurotic don't I?

I am feeling good.

I'm good for several hours of light activity with rest breaks then I'm done so I am going to have to pace myself.

I've been looking at overstock.com because I don't think I'm physically able to go to 5-6 furniture stores and shop.

The running each day with the kid's and a load of laundry and a run to the post office for my eBay is about all I can handle.