Question About Neuropsych Evaluation And Adrenaline

[kwalk]

I did! did terrible- attention, memory, comprehension, the whole works. IQ was really bad as well.

They didn't understand it even for having adhd and depression, especially since I did honors classes in high school. If you have gotten one done, how did you do?

yea er, anyways..... I ended up going to the emergency room because of some very bad choices on my crazy self who has no idea what she's doing. Now I'm off many medications due to side effects and because of some intense observation and evaluations.

Now I am on zoloft, trileptal, propanolol (in which is tremendously helping pots, I rarely go over 100 when I stand now! My migraine headaches are severly reduced from this too, so no more topamax doping me up), ambien(which they are trying to get me off of especially since I seem to have hangovers- by adding more trileptal)

I was tried on vyvanse( stimulant) two days ago,since I seemed to be doing really well mood wise and as I definitely found myself more alert (even did really well on concentration tests compared to before)- the first day I had some anxiety at times with definitely feeling like I was at speed at certain times, while on the second day it was really intense. Today I'm much better anxiety wise without the stimulant and they want me to get a few more tests like another neurological exam, cortisol and catecholamine levels standing up, and see how a higher dose of trileptal goes over the weekend before they think about putting me on a stimulant again.

sorry for going on about so many things, I don't really know my point, but I'm sure it's in there somewhere .

My biggest question besides a neuropsychological test is, what do these feelings of lots of adrenaline feel like to you? has anyone noticed a certain medication that could make it worse? I'm having a hard time deciphering the difference with anxiety and adhd.

[juliegee]

Kwalk,

I've been wanting to chat with you for a while. You remind me so much of my son. His symptoms were probably present all of his life, but went haywire when he was 12 y/o after a GI virus. He was unable to eat and became very lightheaded. He slept most of the time and was forced to drop out of school. Shortly afterwards, he was DXed with dysautonomia.

Mack's had several rounds of neuropsych exams, initially with results quite similiar to yours. I was told his IQ was quite low, yet his achievement scores were very high, as much as 5 years above his grade level. Hmmmmm. Also, major problems with memory (esp. auditory) and speed processing, which led to a misdiagnosis af ADD. The combo of memory and speed processing problems trigger an automatic ADD/ADHD DX which may or may not be accurate. A very specific test, such as the TOVA, can help pinpoint whether or not attention problems are really present.

As you probably know, a learning disability is the discrepancy between IQ and achievement. Psychologists theorize that students with high IQ's, who underperform, i.e. low achievement; have an LD. Using their model, my son (and you) don't exist. It is impossible for students with low IQ's to have high levels of academic achievement so something must be wrong........ Most likely, your IQ wasn't adequately measured.

That's what the last psychologist determined with my son's neuropsych evaluation. She said, "You can cheat down, but not up." In other words, a really intelligent person could chose to do poorly on their IQ test, but a person with a low IQ couldn't chose to do extremely well on his IQ test. She found different ways/tests to measure his IQ. She found it to be on the high side of average, noting that he was visually gifted. My son's in high school now and continues to take honor classes and he gets mostly A's. He is DXed with several LD's. He has an auditory processing problem that is very severe and has led to an additional DX of dyslexia. Mack works very hard, takes a very long time with his work. However, he is willing and is very successful in school. I suspect the same is true of you. It's important to get your neuropsych evaluation right especially if you are still in school as you might qualify for additional time on tests and other accomodations.

My son also has chronic fatigue syndrome, in addition to NMH/NCS. I have since learned that many many students with this DX also have memory, attention, and speed processing issues. Researchers have determined these cognitive difficulties go hand-in-hand with the DX. I suspect that you are dealing with all of this. If you suspect something is wrong with your neuropsych results, there probably is. It is very difficult, but not impossible, to find experienced psychologists who deal with dysautonomia. Please let me know if you want links to research you can show your psychologist.

Also, when my son's symptoms were at his worst; he dealt with awful anxiety. He'd NEVER experienced anything like that before becoming sick. He was (and thankfully once again is) a laid-back skateboarder type. His ped at Hopkins said that the anxiety was purely phsyiological Mack's body sensed when his BP was about to drop about a half hour prior and his adrenaline would go crazy. Dr. Rowe made certain that Mack knew he wasn't emotionally "weak" in any way. AND, some of those ADHD stimulant-type drugs, like aderall, are used to treat POTS/NMH/NCS. AND, if they are appropriate for you, they will improve your learning issues as well as improve your physical symptoms. However, I'd be careful with them, if you are experiencing anxiety as they could certainly worsen things for you.

Sorry for the rambling. We've just been down so many of the same roads that you are navigating and I'd love to show you an easier way. Trust in yourself. Believe in yourself. And, keep on advocating for yourself until you have a support team that "gets" it and believes in YOU.

Big Hugs-

Julie

I did! did terrible- attention, memory, comprehension, the whole works. IQ reallly bad as well.

They didn't understand it even for having adhd and depression, especially since I did honors classes in high school. If you have gotten one done, how did you do?

yea er, anyways..... I ended up going to the emergency room because of some very bad choices on my crazy self who has no idea what she's doing. Now I'm off many medications due to side effects and because of some intense observation and evaluations.

Now I am on zoloft, trileptal, propanolol (in which is tremendously helping pots, I rarely go over 100 when I stand now! My migraine headaches are severly reduced from this too, so no more topamax doping me up), ambien(which they are trying to get me off of especially since I seem to have hangovers- by adding more trileptal)

I was tried on vyvanse( stimulant) two days ago,since I seemed to be doing really well mood wise and as I definitely found myself more alert (even did really well on concentration tests compared to before)- the first day I had some anxiety at times with definitely feeling like I was at speed at certain times, while on the second day it was really intense. Today I'm much better anxiety wise without the stimulant and they want me to get a few more tests like another neurological exam, cortisol and catecholamine levels standing up, and see how a higher dose of trileptal goes over the weekend before they think about putting me on a stimulant again.

sorry for going on about so many things, I don't really know my point, but I'm sure it's in there somewhere .

My biggest question besides a neuropsychological test is, what do these feelings of lots of adrenaline feel like to you? has anyone noticed a certain medication that could make it worse? I'm having a hard time deciphering the difference with anxiety and adhd.

[Megan]

I guess this is a question more than a response, but I was diagnosed with ADHD by my former psychiatrist through a series of questions. Is this an accurate way to diagnose? (I'm not convinced that I have it, as the meds for it made me feel like I did have ADHD in an extreme way, and also because I think the POTS would explain all of it.)

So sorry you've had to deal with med reactions! Before my POTS diagnosis, I went through a ton of anti-psychotic meds through a psychiatrist whom I should probably not have stayed with as long as I did. I do have mild depression and anxiety, but who wouldn't have some anxiety when they have a disorder but everyone says they're a nutter? (I'm much better since being diagnosed, but Prozac is still a necessity for me.) I hope you get a combination of meds worked out. Don't rush; you want to be sure you know which med is giving you a problem if one does.

Meg

[kwalk]

ayi... I would love to find an agreement with you, but before I reached the earlier years of my high school, I had plenty of energy. We had to go all the way back into my elementary school records, and it definitely confirmed I had ADD. I was very slow at my work ( in general people have always found me slow), inattentive to detail, and overall I found that I was called a big ditz when I was a kid.

I was the classic inattentive ADD that really no one notices, so they got away with thinking at first that I did have a language processing disorder, and eventually they said that my listening skills got to that bar of just below average. I'm the kid staring out the window day dreaming about god knows what or looking at random things in the classroom, not paying attention to what I'm suppose to! They as well, thought I had a learning disability, but as time went by with a little help, I could do things on my own and they said that I didn't need help anymore, and I did pretty well on my own.

When I reached high school and things got much harder to make up from my attention difficulties, I finally figured it out and wow if you compared my grades from 9th grade where I wasn't taking medicine to there on after, you'd be really surprised! Suddenly I was much more interested in my classes and everythingg I needed to read, where as before I wouldn't have seem to care or grasped much on the subject because my mind, as my psych tells me is kind of like " a ping pong ball". It's hard to get it to think straight forward as it's bouncing around in circles- but when you give me something to take for it, you'd be surprised of my abilities that are hidden. I'm the definition of procrastination,laziness, random and inconsistency with everything because of my lack of discipline in which is almost impossible for me to control, because I forget what I'm thinking like every two seconds and just lose track. i don't listen unless I want to, though I don't even realize it. I get overstimulated in malls to no end going off on my own. I'm like curious george almost.

It's very hard to understand ADD because attention difficulties are very hard to pin point when you've got these other things going on. I learned more about myself and the way I do things by being as honest with myself about my differences and admitting to myself of all my faults that I usually can't see or didn't want to see. It is really helping me be easier on myself for it in the long run and figure out ways to actually cope.

I got questioned with all the things in the book psych wise- going down the list of classical ADD symptoms and on my neuro psych test, I definitely was evaluated on tests that were just like TOVA. There was a computer test in which I would hit the space bar everytime I saw a letter, in which my reaction was kind of slow, and then when I saw an X I was not suppose to hit the space bar, and everytime I did it too. I did other tests like towers, seeing what I noticed in pictures ( which was SAD), spelling, a series of listening tests, connecting the dots with letters and numbers, the list could go on if I could recall it all... it was a 6 hour process

[juliegee]

Definately sounds like you were tested appropriately & you seem to agree with the ADHD DX. My son had his first neuropsych eval before the major onset of symptoms. He tested just like a classic CFS child before major symptoms hit. Hard to tell what came first and what caused what. Researchers are comfortable stating that many OI/CFS patients have attention, memory, and speed processing problems. These seem to be your issues as well. I'm glad your ADHD meds are helping. They really do when prescribed appropriately. And, sometimes they help with dysautonomia. I hope that's your case. I still question the low IQ. And you should, too :-)

Julie

[juliegee]

BTW, No, Meg, you were not DXed appropriately. Too many amateur psychologists and even pediatricians and family doctors make this DX too easily without adequate information. The subsequent stimulant meds they prescribe can be very harmful if they are not needed. Google ADD/ADHD and read about the DXing procedure.

Julie