ANS stress/Mom has dementia

[Sophia3]

Alzheimers dementia. Been back and forth for a long time. She still has moments of lucidity but now that she is feeling better in the hospital, took out her IV and refused meds. However, she was very clear today and nice and has been holding good conversations for days....but still lying about taking her meds. The change in hospital doc just took place and the nurse told me he did not comment my mom had not taken her synthroid or psychosis meds for two days!?! Nurse said my mom was being so nice about it, she didn't want to FORCE HER....mom doesn't know her dx yet. We hope to tell her as a group with the doc present but that's no easy feat.

They suggested we get temp emergency guardianship but can't afford to do that ($800~ and an indigent attorney was SO HATEFUL when he found out she own a small home, said WELL SHE ISN"T INDIGENT THEN...so I told him sorry to bother his time but he was OBVIOUSLY NOT THE MAN FOR THE JOB and hung up on him...he didn't even try to defend himself but I digress...got his name from Soc Worker and told her not to give his name out again)

Then in 30 days would have to repeat costs or more, to get extended Guardianship. So will fill out Durable Power of Attorney first since today ran into road blocks.... Even with that, she can refuse meds. Last time in 2001, she was in hospital, they had to put her in restraints to take IV and give synthroid meds thru that. This time, they are being nicer to her and letting her skip a couple days. She was dehydrated then and more so now...though still has a pattern of behavior.

Also were shocked to fiind out the psychiatrist thinks she has functional bipolar her whole life....which explains a lot of my mom's behavior...compulsive shopping but stays within her means....screaming spells, up and down moods. however, my mom told the shrink to get out and stop asking stupid questions....she also told the other doctor off that she didn't need an IV and he said she did. So we haven't seen the new doc yet. But gosh, low thyroid can cause dementia but this doc said her values weren't off enough for that..but she is so sensitive to the med she rarely takes it. (oh, the bipolar dx was from a long history of moms behavior from my sister, me and the hospital staff)

So even with Power of Attorney, or whatever, my mom is NOT going to cooperate.

however, the doctors have not yet told her the offical dx. She has no regular doctor...or she hasn't seen him in 3 years and only saw him 2 times total. they can't just RELEASE her. She is waiting to go to interim place in a couple days...and hopefully be stable to go home...the way she has been the last couple days she COULD be home...with meals on wheels started, a 911 necklace and us checking on her....and some neighbors. I would go over a couple days a week since her rages and moods me out of there.

What are the laws in Ohio about taking the home? I was told and read in a Montana long term care web site, That if a dependent or permanently disabled child of any age is living in the house, they can't take the house--if we put it in my name soon. At least it said Medicaid usually won't take the house on the look-back -of three years. I just moved out a couple months ago but just changed the mailing address last month. Otherwise, if you transfer title, they get suspcious and dont care if you are trying to hide assets. My siblings and I would go over to help and maybe spend the night when she progresses, obviously.

ALL MY furniture is still there. My mom's attorney is out of town until Aug 9th.

Anybody know about this kind of stuff? We would like to try to help my mom stay balanced and go in and out of hospital every 2-3 months and get the 20 day reprieved with MediCARE in interim care and stay in her home..But she has to stay out of hospital at least 2 months....and let Medicaid help out since her income is very small.

Anybody have experience with this? Thanks...this is all too much..

[wareagle]

Sophia,

I'm sorry I don't have any advice..I just wanted to let you know that I admire your strength and determination in dealing with all the issues that have been thrown at you lately...you seem like a real fighter..your mother is lucky to have you in her corner.

[KathyP]

Hi Sophia;

I am Power of Attorney for my Cousin who lost her husband last year. I helped her move into a nursing facility. She has no children. She left me in charge of all the legalities. I guess I have to ask you if you are her Power of Attoney? Does she have a Health Care Power of Attorney? If she is the least bit confused or disoriented she won't be able to legally appoint anyone as a Power of Attorney. This is most likely why they are advising you to get an emergency temporary guardianship for her. With her having Alzheimer's odds are that someone is going to have to get guardianship or a Health Care POA no matter what.

With Medicaid, I have experienced that when it comes to long term health care and facilities, the State of Ohio helps when the patient owns nothing. Either selling the house or putting it in someone elses name seems to be the only choices.

Whether anyone has guardianship or POA over her or not will not make her cooperate and take the meds she needs. Whether your Mom is being nice about it or not she still needs her meds as well as proper medical attention.

If I were in your position I would find an Attorney who specializes in Family Law or Long Term Medical Planning for advise. I would also find ways of getting her to take her meds. Contact the Area Office on Aging. They might be able to offer some great ideas. I feel for you. Hang in there. Things will get better.

KathyP

[Sophia3]

Thank you Kathy

Actually, my mom has no real doctor. She hasn't seen the doc for her thyroid in 3 years and rarely takes her meds....

I think she definitely has signs of dementia though was severely dehydrated and hypothyroid when admitted adn they made the diagonsis within 24 hours...then the last 24 hours she has had lucid conversations talking about things from 20-40 years ago and wanted me to get her checkbook so she could sign them and we could pay her bills. So SHE IS LUCID AT TIMES FOR SURE.

We were going to seek guardianship but too costly. Since she is clear now, and the nurses have seen it, I really don't think it would be a problem for ehr to sign for POA.

However I just heard from an attorny on a message board since mom is dx with dementia, any transfer of title may not be legal. I WAS GOING TO BE GUARDIAN and I can't very well give the house to myself. BUT the lawyer says there may be loopholes...like my mom was leaving the house to the 4 of us kids though my 3 siblings want nothing to do with the house.

In cases of disability liviing with pt, the 3 year Medicaid look back "can" be waived. HOWEVER, if the house is awarded to me as a lifetime estate I COULD NEVER SELL IT DOWN THE ROAD because after the real estate taxes, I would have to THEN PAY MEDICAID BACK...so I can't afford to live there now but could with some help from family. Gosh, this is all so complicated.

Thanks for your response.

S

[Dawg Tired]

Yikes Sophia - I admire you for trying to keep it together. Hubby and I are now trying to find the best way to keep our property from going to Medicaid - we really want my son to have it. Isn't much but at least he wouldn't have rent to pay. Hubby and I are both disabled.

I am curious about how things fall out for you legal-wise because this entire issue is SO confusing!

[StaceyYount]

Hey,

We have been going through sort of the same thing with my dad. Have you ever heard of Lewy Body Dementia? One of the hallmarks is that the lucidity comes and goes. My dad was orginally diagnosed with Parkinsons but then last year he went down hill. After much research and some help from a friend I found the Lewy Body. It wasn't until last month he got the diagnosis. Strangly it has OH as one of it symptoms and the lewy bodies can cause problems in your autonmic system. Anyway something to look into since it is not recognized that often and the fact she is in and out makes me think it is a possiblity.

Hope this helps.

Stacey

[Sophia3]

update:

Long story but we really think they PREMATURELY deemed my mom INCOMPETENT while still dehydrated and low on thyroid medicine.

Either of those alone can cause pychosis in elderly!

They deemed her this within 48 hours from ER.

My mom has been clear and lucid for days now and understands things FINE.

So my brother and I decided we are going to send her HOME and rotate checking on her every day among the 4 of us, get a 911 necklace and try meals on wheels.

A neighbor or two are willing to help out.

WHAT A RELIEF!!! And my therapist thought it kind of bogus some "Hospital MD and or attorney/MD" signed the "deemed incompetent certificate" w/o examining her HIMSELF???

We are no Pollyanna's and know that my mom can be difficult but we are going to encourage her to find a NEW DOCTOR and take her Synthroid at least a few days a week...it does make her feel rotten but as long as she takes it a few days a week, it does help.

Her brain may be shrinking but that can happen more in elderly and ALzheimer dx is usually saved for when "you don't know what a car key is for" or you don't know how to care for yourself at all or get lost.

My mom is sharp as a tack most times and does really well playing WHEEL OF FORTUNE!! on tv ...now granted, she is a pathological liar but that is more an underlying personality disorder or functional mild bipolar disorder. So we still have other issues to address but she understood when I explained about the HMO that flim flammed her and I am getting her removed from that.

She understood the need to protect her assets and ad me to her checking account.

She was quick witted and funny.

So NOW, I could get really MAD about the hospital deeming her incompetent...but the nurses treated her wonderfully, were very nice to all of us so we don't want to make a stink. Besides, we would all argue this isn't right.

And when she is HOME, I am going to track down the doctor who signs these papers and tell him she was PREMATURELY dx ALZHEIMERS and would he like to come see my mom and explain HIS WORK ethic, LOL.

Just thought I would share

[Dawg Tired]

Guess that goes to show we aren't the only ones who fall victim to medical incompetence.

Wow - you and she really dodged the bullet! now I hope she takes this reprieve to make the needed adjustments to protect her assets!