Questions To Other Ldn Users

[issie]

I've been trying LDN for about 4 weeks now. . I had to go very low on the LDN or it caused spasms in my neck and back. So, went down to around .5. At first I couldn't sleep and now that has settled out. Started having the dreams that everyone talks about - seems like you must go deeper into sleep. Not having as much pain - that is settling out too.

But, here's the problem. I am starting to have depression. I read on the net that others have had depression with it too. Does that settle out with time?

The other problem is, I have more POTS symptoms. I'm having more orthostatic issues. More drops and that brings more tachy - to try to bring my bp up. Does that too settle out? I have more dizziness and more pre-snocope type feelings. More shortness of breath.

I can't decide if it's the LDN causing these issues or maybe my allergy meds are starting to backfire on me. As, I'm having environmental allergies right now.

Anyone, have any insight into this?

Thanks - in advance!

Issie

[songcanary]

Hi Issie,

I have read that Tramadol has anti depressant qualities. Maybe the depression is a withdrawal symptom?

I have been on 4.5 mg LDN for a couple of years and it never affected my orthostatic problems. Sorry to hear this, I was hoping it would help you. But I had a bit of a rocky period a couple of months in and went down to 3.0 and it helped. Then after another month I went back to 4.5 and have been there ever since. So maybe you'll level out too.

Aren't those crazy dreams something else? I have them every night even still! Take care,

Marsha

[issie]

I thought about that too with the Tramadol. But, my husband pointed out that I go off it every few months to re-set my body --because it stops being as effective --and it doesn't do this to me. He feels like it's the LDN - because about a week into it - is when things started really not being so good POTS wise. But, I'm noticing some good things from it too.

I have read that some are using Tramadol in the day at least 6 hours before taking LDN. They are still taking the LDN for the immune function part of it - but, just not relying on the LDN for the pain relief. I need to see if someone has used it this way and what the results are. If someone with known autoimmune issues - -still gets the benefit if they take something like Tramadol with it. (That way, if the tramadol is what is helping with mood ---that would still be on board.) And, if the LDN would still tweak the immune system and I'd get benefits from it on that level.

Yeah, the dreams are really interesting --it's like you are in a movie and it seems real. I used to not remember dreams - but, with this, I do. But, I'm sleeping through the whole night and barely moving. Wake up relaxed and not in as much pain. The tramadol - didn't take the pain away as well as the LDN is doing.

Tramadol calms my over-active sympathetic system way down and a sense of calm comes over me.

Hoping there are some that maybe can shed some light on this for me.

Marsha, glad it works well for you!!!!

Issie

[ShakeyTheOwl]

Hi!

have had similar with Tramadol as you describe Issie.

It was helpful when it worked.

This link to LDN? and wondering if maybe there is any answers to questions?

http://www.lowdosenaltrexone.org/further_q_and_a.htm

Also, couple years back, had seen Naturopath (she also holds MD, and her ND from Bastyr University, and did 20 years research at Fred Hutchinson Cancer in Seattle) She told me that it was very, very short acting in our system, and at that time was taking Tramadol, she stated I could take it during day, but not 6 hours before LDN dose.

((had no troubles, or effects from either medicine, but also no improvement in condition, at that time I was undergoing testing for Lymphoma, and did not know had Dysautonomia))

Have just ordered a new prescription of LDN and am going to try again to see if improvements, given am not candidate for salt loading or midrodine or Flourinef.

PS- it's taken me a while to participate here on the forum, but have greatly appreciated so much reading the discussions via the mobile phone, so much valuable insight, great folks, research, experiences, and more here on Dinet.org

It's an honor to finally be able to post, and share.

[issie]

Thanks for the link and feedback. Thinking of going off for at least a week and see if things change. Didn't use the LDN last night and woke up with more pain. So, for sure it was helping that. But, like hubby said ---I can always go back on it. But, want to see if the depression lifts and if it's that causing it.

If I'm not mistaken Ultram and Tramadol are the same and that was one med. listed in your link to not take. But, one of the sites I found said it was okay. So, there is confusing, contradictory info out there on it.

Issie

[ramakentesh]

confusing and contradictory for sure when i read through it.

[ShakeyTheOwl]

ok, it's been a while since I have visited this highly recommended Naturopath (people from all over our region recommended her highly because of her background) But this is basically how she explained to me LDN and compounds it at her office, personally.

The way she explained it was how LDN was manufactured and used in the UK (England) for Heroin overdoses, it was coincidence that it helped other illnesses including HIV, and Cancer, research was done in UK regarding, but not here in States.

(so there may be further documents in UK regarding studies on LDN)

Ultram and Tramadol are the same drug, they are not actual opiates, such as morphine, demerol, etc.

The contradiction is regarding LDN and narcotics is that the LDN would stop the opiod from working. (and briefly, short acting)

She mentioned a few times how short acting the LDN is, and for prescribed chronic illness it is very very low dose.

The above link I had posted, regarding LDN, the website is maintained by a friend of family, she is also a medical advocate.

(we've had some interesting discussions regarding auto immune, cancer, diet, food allergies, medications, etc similar to things I've seen few others post in here regarding alternative therapies)

I did do the LDN and Tramadol, and had no trouble, but can say at that time the major thinking of my illness was Lymphoma or type of blood cancer, as it has turned out, it is Dysautonomia, which was not looked at. (OH, PAF, with possible Parkinsonian cause)

(the Hemotologist/Oncologist wrote me up for seeing a Naturopath in his chart notes, and for taking LDN which he admitted he knew nothing of, but wanted to learn more regarding, his eyes perked up when I told him that this Naturopath had spent twenty years in Cancer research at Fred Hutch)

Since Dysautonomia has so many different possible causes, (and no cures) it may be helpful for the ones with auto-immune based, given the LDN research supports some benefit in regards, as well CFS.

Here's another link I grabbed from the Naturopath's website: http://www.ldners.org/resources.htm#Forums

Another one explaining the Narcotic/Opiod and other: http://www.digitalnaturopath.com/treat/T74481.html

[ShakeyTheOwl]

Under "Related Research" are a few interesting pieces:

http://www.ldners.org/research.htm#DM

Related Research:

Imiquimod, An Immune Response Modifier, Is Dependent On 
 The OGF-OGFr Signaling Pathway - MedicalNewsToday.com 7/27/08 
 Exp Biol Med, Aug 2008 Abstract

The role of glutamate transporters in neurodegenerative diseases and
 potential opportunities for intervention.
 Neurochem Int. 2007 Apr 19, Sheldon AL, Robinson MB.
A team including JS Hong at the National Institutes of Health has been researching the neuroprotective effects other compounds similar to Naltrexone

Role of Microglia in Inflammation-Mediated Neurodegenerative Diseases: Mechanisms and Strategies for Therapeutic Intervention



Role of nitric oxide in inflammation-mediated neurodegeneration 



Inhibition by naloxone stereoisomers of beta-amyloid peptide (1-42)-induced superoxide production in microglia and degeneration of cortical and mesencephalic neurons



Dextromethorphan Protects Dopaminergic Neurons against Inflammation-Mediated Degeneration through Inhibition of Microglial Activation

[RichGotsPots]

Issie did you say that your BP is actually low on LDN?