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Scout

Ventricular Tachycardia

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Hi folks,

Hope everyone is well!

I had an episode of what I'm 99% sure was v-tach, tonight (ventricular tachycardia). 

I occasionally have non-sustained ventricular tachycardia, and it's a very distinct feeling when I do. I get PVCs regularly so know the feeling of that sudden thump, and then when I get v-tach, it's the same thump, but much faster, and several in a row — I think tonight was around eight beats of v-tach. It takes my breath away and makes me very dizzy.

I'm going to speak to my cardiologist about it, definitely, but it is so frustrating how, whenever I wear a holter monitor, I don't have an episode.  

Does anyone on the forum have experience with ventricular arrythmias? 

It's making me a bit nervous, as I've had them a bit more frequently lately. 

Thanks so much for any replies.

Happy weekend! :) 

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@Scout - I do not have V-tach but know others who do and I would go to the ER when that happens. Anything over 6 beats is concerning. Please call your cardiologist as soon as he is available and go to ER if this happens again. They can monitor it and give you medication to stop it.  Maybe your cardiologist would consider and implanted loop recorder? I had one for three years - it is essentially a event monitor that gets implanted in your chest and monitors your heart beat all of the time. You push a button when you have symptoms and it marks what happened in the 5 minutes before and after the event. It also records and alerts you if you have an arrhythmia that you are not aware of. Every week and as needed you send the results over a small device directly to your cardiologist for review. I had a few episodes of atrial flutter when I had it ( it ran out of battery and was removed ). The surgery is very minor and very safe and having the device takes all of the guess-work out, plus it gives you and your cardiologist ease of mind. 

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On 10/20/2019 at 3:21 AM, Scout said:

I’m going to speak to my cardiologist about it, definitely, but it is so frustrating how, whenever I wear a holter monitor, I don't have an episode.  

Yes, scary and annoying that it hasn’t been caught on a holter  Have you heard about the Kardia device? https://store.alivecor.com/products/kardiamobile?ds_rl=1263291&gclid=Cj0KCQjwi7DtBRCLARIsAGCJWBqT7CaDrpD4qN7KdZUbz2xkxf9JR8R-LaD8lLP4Ctt9eFzYJmGAKosaAilmEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

It is an FDA approved tiny device that takes an EKG with the help of a smart phone or tablet. You can then email the PDF to your cardiologist. The trick would be catching the episode but I keep it close by to be able to record any cardiac events. An implanted monitor would record the event faster but the Kardia is easier to get. When I have sent strips to my, EP she has replied within minutes. Inability to catch and record events is frustrating!

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@Pistol Thanks so much — I really should discuss a loop recorder! Is the implantation as intrusive as getting a pace maker? I know a pace maker implantation technically isn't considered a major surgery, but I didn't know if the loop recorder has wires that go into the heart or not? What was your experience like, and if you don't mind me asking, which arrhythmia do you have? 

I will be seeing my cardiologist as soon as possible, and will also do another holter monitor or two, just to see if it can manage to catch something! 

@Sushi Oh, that's very cool! I have heard of Kardia but thought it could only be used with apple products, and I have android. Seems it can work with quite a few android devices, however, so I will certainly look into it. I think the website says it can only detect a-fib at this stage, as well as tachy / bradycardia, but still seems worth looking into! 

Thank you so much for the tip :) 

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@Scout - the surgery is very simple and no - there are no wires. A cut, then they make a tiny pocket in the muscle and slide the device in ( which is really tiny ), secure it and sow you back up. Hardly any pain, maybe a little soreness. The cardiologist will set the device to what he wants as parameters, i.e. record any HR under 30 or above 180. There are no restrictions when having the recorder, you can do anything. I got it because I kept passing out and having seizures and he wanted to see if my HR ever drops before these events, so that I could get a pacemaker. But unfortunately in my case everything always goes up, so no pacer for me.  The good part about this device vs conventional halters is that it actually records what happened BEFORE you push the button. Ususally when I pass out I don't get to push it until I regain my consciousness, that could be a while. But with the ILR I push it and it marks the event 5 minutes prior to me pushing the button. This way we can really see what happened and led to the event. Since having had the device I am a strong supporter of it rather than the old halters. And it caught atrial flutter, which I was not even aware I had! After three years the batteries ran out and it was removed in a simple brief procedure. 

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I get these pvc like thumps in a row often too. Maybe a trip to the cardiologist soon for me too. They are not rapid though and do not make me feel breathless and dizzy. I have assumed they are just palpitations. I might get a few when I roll over in bed, stand up ect. Ugh. I dislike my potsy heart. 

Good luck @Scout and let us know how you get on. I hope it isn’t vtach. I agree A loop recorder would be worth asking for

 

xx

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I had SVT and had an ablation in 2017. Best thing I ever did! I haven’t had SVT since. I have read that taking magnesium helps prevent arrhythmia attacks and also potassium. So if your not ready for surgery I would definitely try taking those supplements and see if it helps your arrhythmia and PVCs. It helped me! 

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I do not believe that ablation is used for Vtach, only for SVT. 

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@Jessica_ I had an attempted SVT ablation back in 2010, but sadly it was not successful. They said they found a suitable spot to ablate, but it was far too close to the SA node, and that it was a high risk for damaging it and therefore needing a pacemaker. I was only 22 at the time so they did not want to proceed with that. Hopeful that the next heart monitor I do at least captures something, so I can take that to the cardiologist and go from there. Really glad your ablation worked so well! :) 

@Pistol I think they do them for v-tach, but perhaps much less commonly. I seem to recall hearing that the ventricles are far more sensitive or something along those lines? Not 100% sure, but that rings a bell! Also — thanks so much for sharing your story about the loop recorder implantation. That puts my mind at ease if I get that done. I really appreciate your input as always! 

@MissMermaid So sorry to hear you also get them frequently. Indeed, sounds like a good idea to see the cardiologist just to be safe! Thanks so much for the well wishes. Sending them right back at you, too. 

 

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@jeff_jefferson2 Absolutely, they sure can! 

I know when I have skipped beats, I often have the pre-syncope feeling come over me, as if I am about to faint.  It is especially bad when I have several skipped beats in a row. 

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I had Ventricular Tachycardia, sustained, (not SVT), sustained as in every day for up to 12 hours. It was cured with an ablation nearly three years ago.

I too had the trouble of my episodes never co-inciding with NHS investigations, so I bought my own little ECG, a "Prince 180B". The following print was an exact match to how it looked in the ambulance.

Mine started as very occasional single ectopic beats, that became more common over the course of a few years as they gradually became so often that they joined together to form VT. Beta blockers are what then made the occasional short runs turn into all day and everyday occurrences once they had made me take them and then took me off. Beta Blocker damage is also the reason I am now on this forum. 

 

Early VT from 2016.jpg

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22 hours ago, Peter Charlton said:

I had Ventricular Tachycardia, sustained, (not SVT), sustained as in every day for up to 12 hours. It was cured with an ablation nearly three years ago.

I too had the trouble of my episodes never co-inciding with NHS investigations, so I bought my own little ECG, a "Prince 180B". The following print was an exact match to how it looked in the ambulance.

Mine started as very occasional single ectopic beats, that became more common over the course of a few years as they gradually became so often that they joined together to form VT. Beta blockers are what then made the occasional short runs turn into all day and everyday occurrences once they had made me take them and then took me off. Beta Blocker damage is also the reason I am now on this forum. 

 

Early VT from 2016.jpg

Hi Peter,

I am so glad to hear the ablation helped you! 

It's really interesting to me that you talk about beta blocker damage, because I had a very bad reaction to beta blockers, too, and it made my dysautonomia significantly worse. 

If you're comfortable elaborating, I'd like to hear more about your experience if possible. 

I never experienced PVCs or any ventricular arrhythmia until I started beta blockers several years ago. 

Many thanks!

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The day I took them, (very end 2016), I described feeling as if my lungs no longer worked, that I had to remember to breathe, that I felt like a drunk zombie, that I turned into an old man over-night.

So I right away cut the minimum dosage tablets in half which was just enough to keep my VT at bay, never-the-less, five weeks later I am found at work slumped against the wall, the nurse couldn't detect a pulse so she gave me oxygen which made me feel ok, the ambulance then turned up to find my pulse to be 40bpm, so I wonder what it was before the oxygen?, I wonder what it was when I was asleep and had nightmares about not being able to breathe in view of the feeling I now had to consciously breathe?

So they took me off Bisoprolol around February/March 2017.

When in hospital for VT, the monitors alarm was constantly bleeping because my oxygen was so low, I bought my own oxymeter and found my blood oxygen to be around  85% for half the night. (See attached image). I also had a persistent cough.

April of 2018 the breathlessness, the cough and the low blood oxygen just all got better just like that, for no reason, my guess is that the Autonomic Nervous System which is what beta blockers unbalance, took a whole year to correct itself. The ANS is what monitors your blood oxygen and gets you to breathe correspondingly without you needing to think about it.

I had many other symptoms of a disrupted ANS, early satiety,  a heart beat that would be really variable for no reason, complete loss of the feeling of hunger. The feeling my feet and legs where on fire, numbness of my skin. My memory is now rather poor, I drop things, I instantly forget things I have literally just done.

Whilst the lung part now is fine, my oxygen levels with the same meter are now in the high 90s, but I still feel like a drunk zombie, especially when tired, my head just feels numb, people think I am drunk because of my gait. My own view is that the beta blockers did some sort of permanent damage to my nervous system because the ANS was regulating my oxygen and so I had a long term measure of oxygen deprivation.

I did a DNA test last year, turns out I have genes that make me a slow metaboliser of various drugs, including beta blockers, this means when I take the next days dosage, I still have the previous days inside of me, and so I gradually became overdosed. My cardiolgist initially fobbed me off with the usual "anxiety" claptrap, but he now apologises, especially as he has another patient with exactly the same permanent side effects from Bisoprolol. I had to be medically retired because of it all.

Here is a link of a company that makes medical equipment re Dysautonomia, near the bottom they attribute Dysautonomia to beta blockers, yet its very hard to get anybody in the NHS to believe this, they much prefer to get you out of their office with the "anxiety" fob off.

http://www.qhrv.com/dtr_ans_overview.htm

Here is a link to a discussion on Bisoprolol from others who have been effected. (Though you might have to sign up to read it?), https://patient.info/forums/discuss/beta-blocker-bisoprolol-withdrawal-and-breathlessness-493734

 

 

  

Just sleeping Printing SpO2 Report.jpg

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On 12/6/2019 at 3:19 PM, Peter Charlton said:

did a DNA test last year, turns out I have genes that make me a slow metaboliser of various drugs, including beta blockers, this means when I take the next days dosage, I still have the previous days inside of me, and so I gradually became overdosed. My cardiolgist initially fobbed me off with the usual "anxiety" claptrap, but he now apologises, especially as he has another patient with exactly the same permanent side effects from Bisoprolol.

Very interesting discussion! I also had a DNA test focusing on medications (it was ordered by my cardiologist/EP) and I also had a very abnormal and dangerous metabolism of a beta blocker—metropolol. I also have Afib and it is thought that if Afib is triggered by the parasympathetic system (vagal) that beta blockers can do damage. When I was seeing an autonomic specialist, he said that in his experience, beta blockers were only appropriate for a small percentage of dysautonomia patients. So glad that your ablation took care of some of the problems. I now have all the medications that the genetic test pointed to as being problematic or dangerous, entered into my medical records. I also carry a wallet card listing them.

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