A Warm Bath

[POTLUCK]

I am just wondering if anyone else finds that a warm bath decreases their symptoms. Consistently any time of day, a warm bath ( warmer the better ) will leave me feeling better, decreased brain fog, less dysphoric/lack of oxygen feel, think clearer. It always raises my HR ( Lying and Standing ) also.

I was just wondering if this tells me anything about the type of POTS I have, and/or if this is common, or if some people have the opposite.

I was never really a bath person, as a shower is easier, and I do not really think it is the relaxation, I think it is the warmth, as other relaxation methods do not necesarily leave me feeling better.

[Katybug]

I can get away with a short bath, but, mostly a warm bath makes me feel worse if I stay in it for any length of time.

[sue1234]

I had to quit taking warm baths even BEFORE I had POTS!! Now I can look back and see that was some kind of beginning, a foreshadow or something that was letting me know something wasn't right. But, I was still fully functional and could tolerate outside heat of 95F, I just could take a bath in, what, 110F? It made me feel faintish. So, no, heat is not my friend.

[MandyBrook]

Potluck-- Since becoming sick I have noticed that after showering or bathing I feel MUCH better. However, symptoms slowly come back...

[puppylove]

Warm showers- I feel worse. Sometimes a bath is okay. If I have the chills it always helps. Cold showers help with nausea and blood pooling a little- but they are not too pleasant.

[issie]

Just a thought - heat vasodilates.

Issie

[bellgirl]

Vasodilation does help, if you have high blood pressure with POTS, and it increases circulation. I love taking a bath in the winter, but if I stay in too long, I can get lightheaded, or get strange visual auras, and it does increase my heart rate. Like puppylove was saying, it can cause pooling, though, even in the stomach too close to a meal. It is the only thing that will help me get warm, though, because I freeze in the winter. I wear gloves, scarves and boots all the time. In the summer, however, cold showers are great! I'm so yoyo with my temperature. When the tornadoes hit last year, and we had no electricity for 5 days, I didn't mind taking a cold shower; it was invigorating!!

[ramakentesh]

Yes! In vasoconstrictive forms it could help to a degree. I always feel super cold so every day in winter I have a hot bath at the end of the day. I feel a little hypotensive when i get out (although my BP is always high rather than low) and my arms and legs feel more relaxed and with better 'flow'.

This is the problem I think - we all might have very different forms of POTS here.

The big question is how does extreme vasoconstriction cause dizziness? low blood volume? effecting autoregulation ?

POTLUCK - do you have prominent veins?

[L4UR3N]

I've had variable effects from hot showers/baths. If it is cold outside and I am "cold to the core" then it usually makes me feel better, but if I am anywhere near a normal temp it makes me feel much worse with huge elevations in HR and dizziness (I believe my high BP is a compensatory mechanism that is there to keep me upright!).

If you feel consistently better from a hot bath/ vasodilation, it may point you in the direction of which medications may benefit you! I cannot seem to tolerate anything that causes vasodilation--including warm baths .

[abbyw]

Hot baths are the only thing that helps me get rid of that "cold in my bones" feeling. Too hot for too long used to make me feel faint, but that hasn't happened since the POTS came on. I do not have prominent veins.

Rama - I agree that since we all have different versions, this won't help unless each type is presenting consistently. Let's think about how this "should" present. It would make sense to me that the vasoconstricted people should benefit from the warm baths - the heat should unconstrict them.

[L4UR3N]

Let's think about how this "should" present. It would make sense to me that the vasoconstricted people should benefit from the warm baths - the heat should unconstrict them.

Very true, it should. You would expect that if an issue with vasoconstriction were the primary pathology then warm baths would help. Many of us have a lot of compensatory mechanisms going on which leads to a lot of "confusing" and paradoxical reactions. If vasoconstriction is a compensatory mechanism, then vasodilation will only produce greater symptoms instead of showing improvement. Much the same as beta blockers produce an increase of symptoms in people whose tachycardia is not the cause, but the result of an underlying pathology.

[sue1234]

Rissy, I think that's it. I'm a vasoconstrictor with standing, yet sitting, I get random vasodilation throughout the day. I don't know if they are two separate things, or just my system in a push-and-pull situation.

Because I'm a diagnosed as having a "hyperactive autonomic system" from the TTT, theoretically I should feel good with a warm bath. That is NOT the case--I feel like I'm going to faint and my heart races. I have to take lukewarm showers. So, I don't know what that says about why I have hyperPOTS. Constriction due to low blood volume?? That would make sense, as after the dilation, I don't have enough blood going to the brain. So, I feel much better in cold and taking in caffeine. When I had to give up baths years ago, I made the connection that symptoms were due to vasodilation, but hadn't had anything else in life give me POTS symptoms, so just chalked it up to my weirdness.

[POTLUCK]

Hi,

I was thinking this warm bath thing might help with sorting out the types of POTS, which, of course, is something I am trying to do.

Rama, in answer to " POTLUCK - do you have prominent veins?" yes, but I noticed on the thread on veins the other day that people with both types replied yes. My BMI is 23, ( thin so veins stand out more) and I try to continue doing exercises such as my hand grips-3 sets, and PU-20 and crunches - 15 at least half the days. ( I try for daily, and off meds found I did them very little. They make me dizzy. Exercise seems to do that more with the start and stop than while doing it at a continuous pace. ) I was doing these exercises since years ago so that would increase vein size.

" The big question is how does extreme vasoconstriction cause dizziness? low blood volume? effecting autoregulation ?"

I am thinking it is vasoconstriction in the brain resulting in lack of oxygen to the brain in a "low flow" or hyperadrenergic scenario, and it is lack of blood being pumped up to the brain in a "regular flow" ( splanchnic or visceral dilation and blood pooling there ) or a "high flow" ( blood pooling to lower extremities ) so in the last 2 scenarios the heart is pumping faster to try and push the blood to the brain as it falls down, and in the first scenario ("low flow" "hyperadrenergic") the constricted vessels are never letting enough blood to the brain and the HR is increased even lying down to try and push enough blood in to the brain, yet the pipe into the brain is too small so not enough is going through. Then, when the hyperadrenergic person stands the HR has to go even faster to push the blood through this narrow pipe into the brain against the force of gravity. The low volume just seems like it would go with the fact that all the vessels are squeezed more tight so the volume is forced out at the kidney. The low valume might not be the cause of the problem just a result of the narrow pipes (blood vessels) Now, this does not take into account how these actual mechanisms ( receptors that tell the body how much oxygen it needs, how much urine to secrete etc. ) work, as I certainly do not understand it all.

[forevertired]

Hot tubs, hot baths, and hot showers make my POTS worse. Which is unfortunate, since I love to take hot showers and baths as they do wonders for me emotionally and help with muscle soreness.

[POTLUCK]

Forevertired,

Thanks for weighing in. You have the high HR like me. If you don't mind my asking what about your BP on standing off meds, or on tilt? ( Up, down, about the same ?)

best,

[Hip]

A long hot bath definitely improves my POTS and CFS symptoms. I find that I have less brain fog, less anxiety, and more mental focus and motivation after a long hot bath. I consider long hot baths an important daily therapy. By long, I mean 2 hours or more (I am often very fatiged, so I may fall asleep during the bathing, thus 2 hours passes very quickly for me). A shorter bath does not seem to help anywhere near as much.

But even though my baths take time, I find I am always much more mentally productive after them, and able to mentally focus on tasks much better. So the time "invested" in this hot bath therapy pays cognitive dividends immediately after.

[mwise]

I miss my hot showers and warm baths. I do lukewarm because even though I am cold, hot showers and warm baths make me more symptomatic and fatigued. I wish I could wave a magic wand and make us all normal again. Just find what works best for you and enjoy .

[forevertired]

Forevertired,

Thanks for weighing in. You have the high HR like me. If you don't mind my asking what about your BP on standing off meds, or on tilt? ( Up, down, about the same ?)

best,

My blood pressure on the tilt table test when laying down ranged from 117/70 to 144/90. When standing up during the tilt table it went up then came down a little bit, but was still in the range of pre-hypertensive/ low hypertension. It came down to the mid 120s. I was only standing during the tilt table test for a little more than 5 minutes, so I don't know if it would have fallen more, or went back up. When I am sitting it ranges from below 120/80 (like 110/67) to the high 130's/80s. I have not measured it standing up. I have not yet tried any meds for my blood pressure/heart rate other than florinef. I did not have my blood pressure monitored when on florinef. Does your blood pressure range a lot, like mine does? Or does it only range within about 15 points (like 115/70 to 130/80 for example)?

I know that when I go from standing up to laying down, I often feel palpitations and have problems breathing. Especially if I get up from laying down, then go back to laying down shortly after, like when getting up to turn off an alarm (I tend to lay down for a bit after doing that before getting ready for the day). I should probably buy an at home blood pressure monitor to see what my blood pressure is when that happens.

[abbyw]

(I am often very fatiged, so I may fall asleep during the bathing, thus 2 hours passes very quickly for me).

Off topic, but I hope someone else is in the house with you at the time. That can be much more fatal than POTS!

[issie]

Forevertired,

My bp's are all over the place too. From around 98/78 to 168/116 - they call it liable bp. It's very unpredictable. My surges are very intense and extreme. I'm HyperPOTS and have high NE levels. I don't know if that is the reason - but, it's hard to get under control. Lately, my bp's haven't been dropping as low. More from very high to the normal range - but, it happens so fast that I get those surges because with the exteme drops it triggers tacky to increase the bp's - because the bp's are not supposed to swing that drastic. I'm not a fainter - but, when it happens, I feel like I'm going to faint. There is also a very strong, uncomforable anxiety that goes along with it. I like POTLUCKS description of "a lion being in the room" is how it feels. Panic, fear and a need to get away - but, there isn't any thing to run from. And unfortunately, if we could run - it would still be with us. LOL It's not funny, but - I'd rather laugh than cry. If you find out the reason, I'd be really happy to hear what it is.

Issie

[FarmerAmy]

I love taking a hot bath. I feel bad after I take a shower--especially in the morning. But I feel like hot bath gets everything flowing and I feel a bit better. I can't stay in for too long (more than 15 or 20 minutes) and I generally need to lie down for a little while afterwards.

For me, it has to be a bath, though. Sitting in a hot tub is the worst! Within about 2 minutes I start to feel very lightheaded. I guess I could try to lie down in the hot tub, but the only one I ever go to is at a public pool and there isn't a lot of room.

[POTLUCK]

Forevertired,

Sorry, I wanted to quote this line " Does your blood pressure range a lot, like mine does? Or does it only range within about 15 points (like 115/70 to 130/80 for example)?" so it would call your attention to the answer, but I cannot figure out how to quote part of a section, ( tried highlighting it and hitting quote-maybe someone can tell me)

Anyways, generally my BP is high. Off meds it was all higher than 135 systolic and 85 diastolic, it bounces in the opposite direction of the HR, but stays over those numbers. On Propranolol 140 a day ( 80LA AM & 60LA PM ) it goes a little lower, and now with 75 of Losartan on board it seems to go to a lowest of 110 Systolic and 73 Diastolic- standing, but still fluctuates.

Off topic but did they come up with something to help you sleep?

[Sif]

I love taking a bath, I always feel better afterwards! I don't mind a nice hot shower but I need to sit down on the ground for those, lol. My BP typically goes up when I stand so I don't need to worrying about fainting so much but I get fairly tachy when I stand up and get out.

[GingerA]

Warm baths help my muscle aches from the fibro but make tired. I'm not really one of those long bath people so I don't do it often. Showers are terrible so I shower at night just before bed using the shower chair. I have learned that regardless of bath or shower to take something to drink with me in a water bottle.

[HopeSprings]

This is so weird to me! - I assumed everyone felt worse with warm showers/baths. I can't believe how many are helped by them. Warm baths/showers make me more dizzy. Do you guys also feel better in the heat? If I'm out in the warm sun my heart pounds.