Subluxation

[summer]

I have often read the term subluxation here in relation to joints and EDS.

I am wondering what subluxation feels like. I often get feelings in some of my joints like they have popped out of place a little. I get it a lot in my ankles. I feel like I have to rotate them around or stand up and walk until they pop back in. Its uncomfortable, but not terribly painful. I can't ignore it, though, and HAVE to get it back in place right away. I also get it in my hips, knees and elbows.

Does this sound like subluxation? In which joints do you usually feel it.

Thanks,

Summer

[Katja]

This sounds like what I get - when I described it to my geneticist, she thought I was subluxing those joints. It happens with my hips and toes (mostly the latter, and in this case, they are usually visibly misaligned), though it used to happen to my ankles when I was a kid, as well. I'm not sure if it happens with any other joints - sometimes, it's hard to tell.

[mkoven]

yup-- sounds like it. for me there are degrees of "out"-- from the somewhat uncomfortable, to the excruciating. I've had the sensation in my ankles, meta tarsals, toes, knees, hips/pelvis, low back, neck, shoulders, and elbows. Ankles and hips/pelvis are currently the worst. I also have to slide the pesku joint back in asap. i ignore those who tell me that the noise is "just a gas bubble." I feel bones collide-- that ain't no gas bubble!

[masumeh]

that's wierd, I never heard of subluxing joints like ankles and hips. Subluxation-Dislocation syndrome usually occurs in the shoulder. Is the popping maybe tight ligaments?

I get subluxation in my shoulders. I also have joint problems all over, but they manifest differently in different joints. In ankles, I have tarsal tunnel syndrome...in wrists, carpal tunnel syndrome... my elbow dislocated once (that is excruciating and absolutely NOT common, and I had to get it set by a doctor)... My knee caps dislocate (slide totally out of place to one side or another), which is followed by swelling. It's a very distressing moment, while the cap is out of place, and I cannot move, but need to slowly move so it pops back into place. I'm considering surgery for this, though my orthopedic sx said physiotherapy will probably solve it (it hasn't). Doctors keep suggesting it's muscle group imbalances, where for example the muscle group that pulls a joint one way is too stronged compared to the muscle group that pulls it the opposite way (resulting in tugging the joint out of place).

But sounds like, from other ppl's responses, you have something quite different, and some POTSers here share your symptoms.

Have you seen a specialist about this?

[mkoven]

the popping is actually from loose ligaments. muscle imbalances can "pull" a joint so it is more likely to get injured. for me the combo is the big problem. if i can keep my muscles balanced and out of spasm, i have fewer subluxes. for my hips, this means keeping hip flexors, extesnsors, and stabilizers in harmony-- ha! my hip flexors are a knotty mess and prevent me from engaging my glutes which destabilizes my hips. pt has helped, but my femur still partially slides out of the acetabulum constantly. the ligaments are too banged up to really do their part. if i can catch a popping joint early, before it becomes chronic and really damaged, i have a better chance of addressing it with pt. my kneecaps have settled down nicely with strengthening quads and releasing tight IT band with foam roller.

[summer]

Thanks for the replies. This is something I've experienced as long as I can remember, and thought everyone did until just recently when my husband told me this does not happen to him. My daughters complain of this as well. Maybe it is subluxation. Very interesting that PT helped.

Summer

[jjb]

Subluxes are simply partial dislocations.

When I can feel them, they feel similar to how you describe. A joint out of place and I have to move around to get them back into place. Sometimes I do not feel it coming out of place ... but do feel it going back in.

This has happened to most of my joints and often my ribs. My shoulders are in a subluxed position all of the time ... this I never knew until I was evaluated at the NIH.

[Maxine]

Sometimes I don't know it until I move that area, as I get used to walking around with so many areas partially subluxated, and most recently my ankles, knees, and feet have had issues with this. My shoulders always have, along with my hips. The most serious problem I have is with my neck/cranial area. This is not an area you want to subluxate-----BUT it does.

To me it just feels wobbly, and a shifting sensation-------NOT STABLE. My shoulder blade has completely dislocated, and it's paralizing it's so painful. This has happened twice. Everything feels like it's coming unglued.

Sometimes it's so bad it's difficult to hold my head up.

I was also at NIH study, and still have to more visits.

Maxine :0)

[Amber]

I don't have an EDS diagnosis but I've always noticed that when I pull open doors like at mall entrances my arm always pulls out of the shoulder joint. It usually goes right back in but sometimes can be tender. Also when I lift my leg to put socks or pants on when I go to put the leg back down I always get that bone-on-bone clunk as though the leg bone didn't go back in the socket at the proper angle. That one hurts more. As a child my mom used to tickle my sister and I and would pull at our toes....my sister used to laugh but I always found that so painful because my toes would temporarily come right out of the socket. Sometimes when a bone goes back in the socket it feels like something else got trapped in there with it like a ligament or bit of muscle. This happens alot in my hips and it can be painful and can last days. I also have 'loose' ribs, especially the lower ones. Sometimes when I am just laying still my breathing actually pushes my lower ribs in and out and they make a popping or clicking sound. I can't do much with my ab muscles without those ribs moving around to the point that my costochondritis acts up.

Again, I don't have an EDS dx but then I don't know if my doc ever looked for it. I can't really say if its normal though my healthy friends don't seem to have it happen to them.

Sometimes I think that the only thing holding my body together is the tight muscles from my fibromyalgia! If they ever cure the FM I might just fall apart... 8 )